Fascism: Here To Stay? How Do We End It?

Fascism’s Long Game, Trump’s Weakness, and Why We Fight Anyway

In yesterday’s episode of Amped Up, Cliff Schecter and David Shuster welcomed Dr. Ruth Ben-Ghiat—historian of authoritarianism made for this moment. Their convo concerned our ongoing flirtation with fascism in the form of a thin-skinned, senility-soaked, “President.” They discussed the calculated cruelty of Trumpism, and how elites always think they can “control the monster”—til the monster has ‘em for lunch.

Immediately, Cliff asked a question most of us are thinking: If Trump’s flailing—legally, physically, mentally—why do our institutions still kowtow to him? Dr. Ben-Ghiat was clarifying: fascists survive not just on violence or propaganda, but loyalty of elites who think they’ll be ok, or benefit It’s not just Trump—but the MAGA machine and long game. Having written six books on Italian fascism, she knows a bit here :)

They dug into Project 2025, which Ben-Ghiat warned isn’t just a policy blueprint, but a roadmap to autocracy. She broke down how regimes like this hollow out democracy from the inside, replacing courts, the bureaucracy, and independent watchdogs’ loyalty to law with loyalty to one anti-social, grievance-filled buffoon. Sound familiar?

One of the most powerful exchanges came when they discussed how MAGA’s eating itself alive over Iran. The grift, disinformation, wildly contradictory narratives, all are starting to combust under their own weight. And yet, that’s precisely when these movements can be most dangerous.

Cliff tied it back to a truth we can’t repeat too often: we’re not powerless. We can and must resist. Dr. Ben-Ghiat emphasized that history shows strongmen only win when the people give up—become too exhausted, cynical, or scared to act. But those who stand up—fighters, organizers, and truth-tellers—they can shift the tide.

Perhaps the most interesting part, was that during the entire conversation Dr. Ben Ghiat used her wealth of information on the subject to make a series of fascinating comparisons from history and our current moment. From the likes of Mussolini, Hitler and Amin, to Orban, Putin, and Erdogan.

This was one of those episodes that leaves you shaken and stirred. If you needed a reminder that this fight is worth it, and that knowledge is power in the face of creeping tyranny, this one’s for you!

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